My parents and I do not see eye-to-eye on this election or many things. But, at this late hour (them in their late-70s and not particularly healthy, me in the last year of my 40s and living on the other side of the world), we've made an unspoken agreement to just love each other and not speak about things that spiral into non-listening, reactive exchanges. It's good enough, for us. It's worlds better than the alternative (which wouldn't change anyone's minds anyway).
I have much more trouble letting go of the shaming and gaslighting by many pro-Harris folks online - I find myself unsubscribing, unfollowing, and muting quite often these days (not because they are pro-Harris, but because they are dehumanizing and shaming anyone who asks questions or doesn't share all their opinions and beliefs). And, to be clear, I agree with certain liberal, progressive views - until the pandemic (and the way I was treated as an unvaccinated person, and the way medical rights and freedom were squashed), I voted Green or Democrat. But the way I see it now, there is no democracy, really. Money and power are in charge. Money and power are being used to kill people and do things that I'm deeply against. So, I voted. But I'm under no illusion that this election (whoever wins) will radically change things. Time for the Serenity Prayer...
Thank you for sharing your experiences Dana. I understand and I have shared a similar experience—not within my own family and not within my group of friends—but online for sure. The venomous nature of the “you must agree with me or I will hate you” tribe is brutal and intolerant. It is this that most alarms me—the hatred and intolerance—I couldn’t care less who someone votes for or supports. 🤷🏻♂️
Thank you for touching the third rail with me—you are fearless ❤️
Well said Dana & Dee, excellent article. I’m in LA where I feel like I’m tiptoeing around landmines every day & am at the point I just keep my head down trying my best to avoid any political convo. What happened to middle ground & civil debate:-(
Thank you, and right? When did it become a thought crime to disagree about things or to not know how we feel about something or to not fall in lockstep with one narrative or the next? This world and our experiences are vast - to expect everyone to agree on everything or see everything exactly the same makes no sense to me. And I certainly would never assume that people who don't agree with me on everything are bad or dangerous people.
Thank you David. I appreciate you reading and commenting. I write about “10-foot pole” issues often, but this one really fires people up right now for obvious reasons.
Thanks for sharing this, Dee. I feel like people in recovery are the best equipped to weather these divisive times. Glad I’ve joined y’all’s ranks in time for this election. And beyond.
I seem to be having glitches in my stack feeds recently (not showing new posts in my inbox nor new notes in my Home Screen). So I’m glad that someone told me about this post so I could interact with you.
First of all. I send love and respect out to you and Ann, and I deeply love that you and your friend did this in every interaction you speak about.
I agree that it feels like the extremists have taken control of both political parties. Hatred is rampant, as are rudeness, foul attitudes and lies. Both choices are challenging, as usually happens.
One thing that echos in my mind is what I posted on FB about…I wrote: I’m not into making political statements, but… a user I know on Substack wrote the best post yet :
Just a note to all the women out there. If everyone you know is voting for a president who hates women, hear this. You don’t have to tell a soul that you voted differently than your spouse, friends, etc. Use your one precious vote however you want. But don’t let anyone intimidate you into voting for someone with whom you would not be safe in a room alone.
~Emily Sutherland
It matters so much to me that I cannot in good conscience vote for someone with whom I would not be safe in a room alone. Bottom line.
Thanks so much for weighing in so passionately. I understand how you feel about the Orange man and I do not argue—because I don’t know what it would feel like as a woman.
I’m so glad to hear you reference examining your own opinions and responses. At the end of the day that is the healthiest thing—there is no such thing as a “right” or “wrong” opinion or belief. There’s only yours, mine, and theirs. 🤷🏻♂️🙏
I agree totally. And I respect every person’s right to have their own opinion, make their own choices and live as they choose (as long as they aren’t taking any victims nor hostages 🤪)
Ps… for those of my connections who become degrading, rude, nasty and derogatory? I simply cease speaking with them. There’s no excuse for that behavior.
Dee, a long Friday and I was bored tonight and decided to catch up on some reading. This was awesome. So well written and I think perfectly encapsulates the viewpoints of the voters while more importantly offering everyone a way forward in relationships. Thank you for making my day! 🙏
I started a response a while ago, but I got distracted.
For most of my life, I lived and worked in places where politics were often ugly and violent. I always kept my mouth shut because I was a foreigner and I technically had no dog in the fight. Technically, because when I watched the ways politicians intimidated people, killed or locked up opponents, and got themselves elected with absolutely transparent cheating, I could see what was happening, but as a foreigner, I kept my mouth shut.
I feel like a foreigner in this country now, with the vicious partisanship, the ugly name calling, and the dehumanizing of those with different political views. I don’t know how this trend started. I have some ideas, because it’s the same kind of political climate that is on such a razor edge that no one can rule out violence over the results. I watched the genocide up close in Rwanda as 800,000 people were murdered and it all started with subtle, dehumanizing comments in the media. The same thing happened during the collapse of Yugoslavia. Groups were dehumanized. Ethnic clashes first then murderous ethnic cleansing took place. I saw Orthodox churches, Catholic Churches, and mosques bulldozed along with nearby cemeteries and covered with earth so it was as if they were never there.
In another country where we lived, there was a cemetery near our house we visited once, only to find all those graves with a different ethnicity were desecrated. It’s a very fine line between dehumanizing and genocide.
I see it here on Substack. Several posters do drive by shooting type posts. I must ignore scores of comments on the main feed that are dehumanizing and eliminationist. If I steer even a little off the main feed, the ugliness is overwhelming. I find it triggering to read them, because I think of butchered corpses floating down rivers and stacks of skulls along roadsides. I’m not overstating my case. Yugoslavia and Rwanda turned into a killing field in a few short weeks or months. Once the genie is out of the bottle, it takes years to reconcile and to clean up the wreckage.
Part of me doesn’t want to vote as a protest. I don’t know if the election is fair. I don’t want to be part of the partisan ugliness. I have a friend who received two mail in ballots from a state she no longer even lived in. How do we know how deep the rot is? Does my citizenship even mean anything any more?
But I will go through the motions. Nothing about this process makes me proud or hopeful. In fact, the only reason I can think to vote is so I can say I tried to do something. I have very little hope about the goodness of that something.
Wow. Had to read it twice. Your comment is so powerful because of your lived experience in those areas and what you witnessed there.
I used to work in sports television and I remember talking at length with the men on the Yugoslav volleyball team at the ‘96 Olympics about the hatred in their country—then it all exploded.
You are 100% correct—we are a hair’s width from all of it—and most are oblivious to that reality.
I do think smartphones and social media have turned everyone into weak little keyboard warriors with no ability to actually do anything to anyone else. That said, I do not want to find out.
I share your cynicism—as you already know—I’m not sure it’s able to be to fixed.
If only some of our politicians had the grace to exile themselves when they get rancid. There’s one old bint and her horndog husband who have been public fixtures for half my life and honestly, they have not improved with time. If they pulled up stakes and moved to say, Sudan, where the horndog once showed some interest, at least their old grudges, scandals, and cronyism would be replaced by fresh grudges, scandals, and cronyism. Give the kids a chance at becoming rancid.
Thank you K for appreciating and for sticking around. 🙏
I know it’s treading on treacherous ground to reveal anything about our politics. I wanted to represent it in a different way with the focus on relationships.
🙏 it’s already cost me a few subscribers—even paid ones. There’s a lot of anger out there—even when you present an opinion gently. So be it. It’s worth talking about.
My parents and I do not see eye-to-eye on this election or many things. But, at this late hour (them in their late-70s and not particularly healthy, me in the last year of my 40s and living on the other side of the world), we've made an unspoken agreement to just love each other and not speak about things that spiral into non-listening, reactive exchanges. It's good enough, for us. It's worlds better than the alternative (which wouldn't change anyone's minds anyway).
I have much more trouble letting go of the shaming and gaslighting by many pro-Harris folks online - I find myself unsubscribing, unfollowing, and muting quite often these days (not because they are pro-Harris, but because they are dehumanizing and shaming anyone who asks questions or doesn't share all their opinions and beliefs). And, to be clear, I agree with certain liberal, progressive views - until the pandemic (and the way I was treated as an unvaccinated person, and the way medical rights and freedom were squashed), I voted Green or Democrat. But the way I see it now, there is no democracy, really. Money and power are in charge. Money and power are being used to kill people and do things that I'm deeply against. So, I voted. But I'm under no illusion that this election (whoever wins) will radically change things. Time for the Serenity Prayer...
Thank you for sharing your experiences Dana. I understand and I have shared a similar experience—not within my own family and not within my group of friends—but online for sure. The venomous nature of the “you must agree with me or I will hate you” tribe is brutal and intolerant. It is this that most alarms me—the hatred and intolerance—I couldn’t care less who someone votes for or supports. 🤷🏻♂️
Thank you for touching the third rail with me—you are fearless ❤️
Well said Dana & Dee, excellent article. I’m in LA where I feel like I’m tiptoeing around landmines every day & am at the point I just keep my head down trying my best to avoid any political convo. What happened to middle ground & civil debate:-(
Thank you, and right? When did it become a thought crime to disagree about things or to not know how we feel about something or to not fall in lockstep with one narrative or the next? This world and our experiences are vast - to expect everyone to agree on everything or see everything exactly the same makes no sense to me. And I certainly would never assume that people who don't agree with me on everything are bad or dangerous people.
If this nation (this world) could respect one another’s differences of opinions the way you and your friend do, our country wouldn’t be in such peril.
True and thank you Allison 🙏
Alas… 🥲
Incredibly well done, insightful, and worth everyone's time to read. By the way? I use that my life my rules image on a regular basis :)
Thank you David. I appreciate you reading and commenting. I write about “10-foot pole” issues often, but this one really fires people up right now for obvious reasons.
Thanks for sharing this, Dee. I feel like people in recovery are the best equipped to weather these divisive times. Glad I’ve joined y’all’s ranks in time for this election. And beyond.
🙏
I seem to be having glitches in my stack feeds recently (not showing new posts in my inbox nor new notes in my Home Screen). So I’m glad that someone told me about this post so I could interact with you.
First of all. I send love and respect out to you and Ann, and I deeply love that you and your friend did this in every interaction you speak about.
I agree that it feels like the extremists have taken control of both political parties. Hatred is rampant, as are rudeness, foul attitudes and lies. Both choices are challenging, as usually happens.
One thing that echos in my mind is what I posted on FB about…I wrote: I’m not into making political statements, but… a user I know on Substack wrote the best post yet :
Just a note to all the women out there. If everyone you know is voting for a president who hates women, hear this. You don’t have to tell a soul that you voted differently than your spouse, friends, etc. Use your one precious vote however you want. But don’t let anyone intimidate you into voting for someone with whom you would not be safe in a room alone.
~Emily Sutherland
It matters so much to me that I cannot in good conscience vote for someone with whom I would not be safe in a room alone. Bottom line.
As to how I avoid deep divides, with those I choose to love, over politics? I’ve been using some of the techniques talked about in this podcast… where it feels important to question myself when I am “sure” that I am right. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ten-percent-happier-with-dan-harris/id1087147821?i=1000672265136
Over and over I try to repeat to myself …. “But what if they’re right”.
Thanks so much for weighing in so passionately. I understand how you feel about the Orange man and I do not argue—because I don’t know what it would feel like as a woman.
I’m so glad to hear you reference examining your own opinions and responses. At the end of the day that is the healthiest thing—there is no such thing as a “right” or “wrong” opinion or belief. There’s only yours, mine, and theirs. 🤷🏻♂️🙏
I agree totally. And I respect every person’s right to have their own opinion, make their own choices and live as they choose (as long as they aren’t taking any victims nor hostages 🤪)
Ps… for those of my connections who become degrading, rude, nasty and derogatory? I simply cease speaking with them. There’s no excuse for that behavior.
No room for toxic people. I’m done. Time is short.
A balanced, thoughtful, and nuanced discussion on our current political situation... and on the value of rational dialogue.
Respect, brother 🫡
Thank you Stone. 🙏
Probably the best piece I have seen written about this election yet. You are a good man Dee.
Thank you Matthew that means a lot to me for you to say that. 🙏
Dee, a long Friday and I was bored tonight and decided to catch up on some reading. This was awesome. So well written and I think perfectly encapsulates the viewpoints of the voters while more importantly offering everyone a way forward in relationships. Thank you for making my day! 🙏
Thank you for checking in on my essay James. I appreciate your comments 🙏
I started a response a while ago, but I got distracted.
For most of my life, I lived and worked in places where politics were often ugly and violent. I always kept my mouth shut because I was a foreigner and I technically had no dog in the fight. Technically, because when I watched the ways politicians intimidated people, killed or locked up opponents, and got themselves elected with absolutely transparent cheating, I could see what was happening, but as a foreigner, I kept my mouth shut.
I feel like a foreigner in this country now, with the vicious partisanship, the ugly name calling, and the dehumanizing of those with different political views. I don’t know how this trend started. I have some ideas, because it’s the same kind of political climate that is on such a razor edge that no one can rule out violence over the results. I watched the genocide up close in Rwanda as 800,000 people were murdered and it all started with subtle, dehumanizing comments in the media. The same thing happened during the collapse of Yugoslavia. Groups were dehumanized. Ethnic clashes first then murderous ethnic cleansing took place. I saw Orthodox churches, Catholic Churches, and mosques bulldozed along with nearby cemeteries and covered with earth so it was as if they were never there.
In another country where we lived, there was a cemetery near our house we visited once, only to find all those graves with a different ethnicity were desecrated. It’s a very fine line between dehumanizing and genocide.
I see it here on Substack. Several posters do drive by shooting type posts. I must ignore scores of comments on the main feed that are dehumanizing and eliminationist. If I steer even a little off the main feed, the ugliness is overwhelming. I find it triggering to read them, because I think of butchered corpses floating down rivers and stacks of skulls along roadsides. I’m not overstating my case. Yugoslavia and Rwanda turned into a killing field in a few short weeks or months. Once the genie is out of the bottle, it takes years to reconcile and to clean up the wreckage.
Part of me doesn’t want to vote as a protest. I don’t know if the election is fair. I don’t want to be part of the partisan ugliness. I have a friend who received two mail in ballots from a state she no longer even lived in. How do we know how deep the rot is? Does my citizenship even mean anything any more?
But I will go through the motions. Nothing about this process makes me proud or hopeful. In fact, the only reason I can think to vote is so I can say I tried to do something. I have very little hope about the goodness of that something.
Wow. Had to read it twice. Your comment is so powerful because of your lived experience in those areas and what you witnessed there.
I used to work in sports television and I remember talking at length with the men on the Yugoslav volleyball team at the ‘96 Olympics about the hatred in their country—then it all exploded.
You are 100% correct—we are a hair’s width from all of it—and most are oblivious to that reality.
I do think smartphones and social media have turned everyone into weak little keyboard warriors with no ability to actually do anything to anyone else. That said, I do not want to find out.
I share your cynicism—as you already know—I’m not sure it’s able to be to fixed.
If only some of our politicians had the grace to exile themselves when they get rancid. There’s one old bint and her horndog husband who have been public fixtures for half my life and honestly, they have not improved with time. If they pulled up stakes and moved to say, Sudan, where the horndog once showed some interest, at least their old grudges, scandals, and cronyism would be replaced by fresh grudges, scandals, and cronyism. Give the kids a chance at becoming rancid.
Grace is not a political skill
Thank you K for appreciating and for sticking around. 🙏
I know it’s treading on treacherous ground to reveal anything about our politics. I wanted to represent it in a different way with the focus on relationships.
🙏 it’s already cost me a few subscribers—even paid ones. There’s a lot of anger out there—even when you present an opinion gently. So be it. It’s worth talking about.
We cannot. And yes my friend it’s not about like or dislikes or subscribe or not—it’s about open hearts and mutual respect.
I have yours and you have mine and that’s most wonderful 🙏